QA/Meetings/2014/July 30

=Prep=

= Agenda + Minutes =

 Minutes:

Content from the meeting itself ("the minutes") will be displayed in blue boxes like this.

Before we Start
A few minutes before we officially start the call, we'll try to have a few people on hand to help assist newbies set up their teleconferencing gear, get things muted, and log on to all of our communication channels:
 * QA/IRC
 * Etherpad - QA Pad
 * Talkyoo or Google Hangout

Start
Put start time and attendees list in the table

IRC Minutes
 (Meeting will be in Talkyoo)

The State of QA
Including any Opening Discussion


 * xx- Bugzilla migration
 * Updates...
 * Re: need to reset passwords
 * Email notification ahead of migration
 * Tweak the change-password page and the front page to indicate that people will need to reset their passwords
 * Create an 'About our new Bugzilla' video as a part of our 'Intro to QA' series


 * Bugzilla:
 * SUGGESTION: Use bugs.documentfoundation.org/ to host Bugzilla
 * We can have both LibreOffice and some of the Document Liberation Project libraries all exist as top-level products in the bugtracker
 * QUESTION: Should we refocus ourselves as the TDF QA Team (to cover LibreOffice, DLP, etc.. ?)


 * Boston Hackfest happened
 * Mmeeks, Joel, Robinson, Algot, Immanuel, etc..
 * Had Inkscape developer (Martin) show up
 * Got some ideas for the next one
 * Some hurdles with directions to venue (hard to find)
 * Investigate lodging closer to venue
 * Big thanks to Xamarin and Michael's brother for hosting us!
 * ACTION: Send thank-yous to Xamarin and Michael's brother (Joel)
 * Use 'hackfest' name for next event? Perhaps look at alternative names (Joel)
 * But want to make sure to attract devs (Bjoern)
 * Make sure that we're clear about the purpose of the hackfest ahead of time (Joel)
 * Going to have an event in Seattle in October (Robinson)
 * Aiming to build up community enough so that in the future, local people can run similar events on their own
 * Head-off issues at the event by having a quick 5 minute talk at the beginning of the event about how to handle complaints in Bugzilla/on the user lists (Bjoern)

weekly status

 * https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/page.cgi?id=weekly-bug-summary.html

UNCONFIRMED Bugs
UNCONFIRMED bug count:
 * July 16thd: 962
 * Today: 712
 * Difference: -250


 * ACTION: Joel will come up with strategies (bloggers? other marketing?) to get us under 500 UNCONFIRMED over the summer (by the end of August)


 * Many bugs that went UNCONFIRMED -> NEEDINFO were moved to REOPENED, so Joel is working on fixing those
 * How do we avoid new QA people getting lost in 'hard' UNCONFIRMED bugs that they aren't going to be able to attack? (Robinson)
 * One idea: query for 'expected behavior' (Bjoern)
 * I am seeing more and more bugs in 'UNCONFIRMED' that require specific hardware, proprietary software, a developer's input, etc.. (Joel)
 * What should we do with bugs that have been confirmed on a single system, but nobody else can reproduce, even after multiple attempts? (Joel)
 * What about bugs requiring proprietary applications/etc.. do we close those? (Joel)
 * Similar to dealing with confidential documents: If you can't share it, then we won't fix it (Bjoern)
 * Refer them to how the Linux kernel deals with proprietary drivers
 * Any proprietary software that relates to filters in the source (for MS-Office, Visio, Project, etc..) is probably something we should try to investigate (Robinson)
 * 'Enterprise' software?
 * Something to consider re: what we can triage

Regression watch (Bjoern)

 * Regressions in 4.3 not in 4.2
 * Previous Counts: 32, 37, 41, 46
 * Regressions in 4.2 not in 4.1
 * Previous Counts: 65, 85, 99, 102


 * ACTION: Joel will dig through bibisected and regressions confirmed bugs and prioritize according to flowchart


 * Some new people joining-in with bibisecting (Joel)

Topics for ESC?
Does anyone have any topics/concerns that I should bring to the Engineering Steering Committee (ESC)? (Robinson)


 * Query for bibisected regressions: Bibisected bugs
 * Broken down by component and Severity
 * Previous counts: 64, 81, 94, 95, 108, 129


 * Nothing big
 * We've seen many more bibisected regressions, and devs are tackling more regressions, so QA is helping quite a bit (Bjoern)
 * Important for writer devs to make sure that we're dealing with new regressions first

needAdvice Bugs
needAdvice bugs
 * Previous counts: 80+, 32, 32, 29, 23


 * Please continue to shovel difficult bugs into this list (Robinson)

PENDING ITEM: Auto-updates for regular users and QA Testing

 * ACTION: Investigate auto-updates for regular users and/or for QA/testing purposes (Robinson)
 * ACTION: Open discussion again re:auto-update for QA on the mailing list (Robinson)
 * Related: - "LibreOffice-Installation enhancement/medium NEW UI: Provide RSS feed for torrent downloads" (Joel)
 * ACTION: Bring up proposal to use Mozilla updater tooling for LibreOffice (Robinson)


 * Two questions that arise: (Robinson)
 * Should we provide non-stable versions via updater?
 * Should we make it easier to update (automatically?) from one build to the next?
 * Auto-updates is an enterprise feature -- will a volunteer do it for free? (Bjoern)
 * What about the GUI?
 * What about users on Ubuntu (or another distro) who want to track 'LibreOffice Fresh'? (Robinson)
 * Use this Ubuntu PPA that essentially tracks what TDF calls "fresh": https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/ppa (Bjoern)
 * Cool -- didn't know that this existed! (Multiple people)
 * Can also get the latest versions by using Release-version-specific PPAs: https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/libreoffice-4-2
 * What about a PPA that tracks 'LibreOffice Stable' ?
 * Under consideration... (Bjoern)
 * Waiting to hear from LibreOffice Marketing about name change for 'Stable'

PENDING ITEM: Bugzilla Migration etc.

 * ACTION: Organize time to stress-test new Bugzilla VM (Joel)
 * ACTION: Make sure to suppress outgoing email during our testing of the test Bugzilla (Robinson)
 * ACTION: Perhaps add Simple HTTP Auth (htaccess) control restricting access to https://bugzilla-test.documentfoundation.org/ (Robinson/Norbert)
 * ACTION: Resolve url for hosting our Bugzilla instance (Joel)
 * Deal with acronym if using tdf.org url (tdf# ?)


 * ACTION: Set up call and/or thread(s) with the useful people on a mailing list (Robinson)
 * May 22 - Started process
 * June - Need to follow-up again with key people re: current progress (Robinson)



PENDING ITEM: Bibisect Repositories

 * ACTION: Chat w/Bjoern, etc... re: updates to bibisect repos (Robinson)
 * Propose docs on testing w/3.3.0 separately to place bugs in pre-LO category (Robinson)
 * ACTION: Provide documentation for mac bibisect on wiki (Norbert)
 * Perhaps ask Cloph for help re: Bibisect stuff, and keep Norbert's cycles free for Bugzilla migration

To review:
 * IDEA: Add bibisect into regular Developer workflow
 * IDEA: Create graph/tool to show which builds contain a given commit



PENDING ITEM: GUI for Bibisect

 * ACTION: Review BibiGUI -- any Windows/C# Python volunteer dev (Bjoern)
 * June 19 - Joel may have found a volunteer?
 * ACTION: Create an EasyHack a bug for the process of rewriting the existing C# code in Python (or Java) (Florian R.)
 * ACTION: Joel will poke the new guy again on email that showed up with dev experience

Related:
 * ACTION: SI-GUI: Contact the people running "interesting" Windows tinderboxes and ask for their assistance (Florian R.)



PENDING ITEM: Hackfests

 * ACTION: Check on status of LibreOffice building in the cloud for hackfests (Robinson)
 * Included in the notes for hackfest planning

Update on:
 * Events/2014/US Summer Hackfest
 * Other Events: (School in Pennsylvania)?


 * We had one, it was interesting (see notes above)

=== PENDING ITEM: Whiteboard Naming Conventions ===
 * ACTION: Update tags in the whiteboard to use 'wimpyCaps' (ALL)
 * Also continue to clarify the use of capitals in the whiteboard, etc..


 * Haven't heard complaints from QA or Devs
 * Let's go ahead and use this extensively
 * We'll talk about "filter:svg" stuff in the whiteboard after the call (in IRC)

Long-term/Frozen Pending Items
These are long-term or frozen items (i.e. on ice until something else happens) that we don't want to forget about...

PENDING ITEM: MozTrap Localization

 * ACTION: MozTrap translation (GUI and tests) continues to be high-priority for QA (Needs someone to shepherd)

To review:
 * Other project who might want to work on translating GUI w/us?



PENDING ITEM: Feedback pages

 * ACTION: Sophie will shepherd native-lang versions of Feedback page

To review:
 * Next steps for NL versions (bug #?)



PENDING ITEM: US Merch Store

 * (Future progress)

PENDING ITEM: Most Annoying Bug List

 * ACTION: Joel will propose stricter guidelines for what qualifies as a MAB

To review:
 * How is the test going? (using the 'Priority' field in Bugzilla)

References:
 * MAB Tool - Server/service down for now



PENDING ITEM: Talk to CS Department/others at University

 * ACTION: Put up a message on the message board at his University and see who is interested (Joel)
 * Need to meet w/Charlie R. to talk with his Uni contacts as well

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New Action Items
All items proposed between meetings go here

NEW ITEM: Discuss usefulness of QA project in Redmine (Bjoern)
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NEW ITEM: QA Budget (Bjoern)
Some ideas for our possible QA Budget


 * Host bibisect repo in the cloud -- use VNC to connect
 * Testing builds in the cloud @ the Boston Hackfest -- good for 1-off testing, but slow for 10 bibisects in a row (Robinson)
 * Perhaps a good target for onboarding (Bjoern)
 * Makes things run very quickly, get people hooked
 * We can spin-up a new machine for each person we're onboarding
 * Daily builds (also in the cloud?)
 * SDK tutorial?
 * Get python community interested in LibreOffice
 * Python IDE support for creating LibreOffice extensions?
 * Can be beneficial for both communities
 * Need to find someone in Python community to help move this forward


 * Hackfest hardware
 * Especially helpful when we don't have good bandwidth/stable connection
 * Other items
 * Crash reporter for Windows
 * Moztrap improvements
 * Ask sophie about a solid proposal for what could be done
 * Native-lang BSA for more projects
 * Biggest hurdle is getting native-lang communities to sign-up for long-term commitment to deal with bug reports (Robinson)

New Items (Proposed/Discussed at the Meeting)
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Announcements

 * ANNOUNCEMENT: Our next meeting will take place... July 30th (Wednesday) at 17:30 UTC, unless otherwise noted on the QA/Mailing List.

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End
Put meeting-adjourned time in the table

= Topics = (Add topics below and reference them as in the Agenda/Minutes above)