Design/Meetings/2014-11-19

Link
http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Minutes-of-the-Design-Hangout-2014-11-19-tt4129860.html

Minutes
Nov 21, 2014; 6:39pm Jan Holesovsky-4 Minutes of the Design Hangout: 2014-11-19

+ Kendy: Switch Sifr to be the default icon set on macOS + Jay: Check if the toolbar is not too wide after the recent changes + Jay: Gallery tooltip reverted + Jay: Sync the track changes shortcut with MSO + change the edit mode shortcut + Jay: Collect problematic .uno: commands in Draw/Impress (where     slides are called pages and vice versa) + Ahmed: Get access to the new Sifr github repo + Kendy: Create Easy Hack for images.zip layering (if it does not     exist yet) + And also Easy Hack for downloading additional themes? + Kendy: GSoC task (or so) for converting "Manage Changes..." to     sidebar (instead of non-modal dialog) + Kendy: Adjust alignment and spacing in line spacing drop down - https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=83076#c11 + Kendy: Sidebar - hide the decks, but keep the sidebar (only the     icons) there. https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85935 + might make sense to do the same thing in Calc - Styles button is gone in the toolbar too + Samuel: Add Close menu entry in the sidebar's menu that acts like View -> Sidebar toggle https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85937 + Jay: Tweet / G+ / ... about the conference logo need + Kendy: Do / find someone / easy-hack-ize automatic opening of the Track changes toolbar when we are tracking changes + More fixes to Calc toolbar (Jay) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85594 + Additional fixes to Impress toolbar and new revamp of Draw (Jay) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=84909 + Swapping increase and decrease buttons in Sidebar (Jay) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85776 + Default to Sifr icon set on macOS (Kendy) + Many Sifr icons updated and added (Papamatti, Jay) + Improvements in various dialogs (Adolfo) + Addition of new and updated tango icons (Alex, Jay) + Merge Document being outside of the Track Changes submenu (Jay, Cor) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85046 + there was no disagreement in the meeting, but then Cor updated the etherpad that he does not agree :-)       + tried this feature, and actually it is either broken, or          really bad from UX point of view (Kendy)            + got the explanation from Jay            + and seems pretty much misnamed :-) (Jay, Kendy) + Sophie agreed with the change in comment 34 + Cor stated he'd file an official protest and reverted the change in another bug report https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86252 + suggestions of other names for the feature (Jay) + Merge Other Changes... (Jay) + Import Other Changes... ? (Kendy) + leaving it for another time, needs more work anyway (Jay) + Placement of header and footer (Jay) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86440 + different places in all Writer / Calc / Impress! + suggests under Insert (Jay) + or Edit (Cor) + but not View + one more option: Format (Stuart) + competitive analysis: MSO (Word, Excel) has it in 'Insert', Calligra in 'Create', Pages don't have that in the menu, WordPerfect has it in 'Insert' + apparently they have it tight to the creation/insertion functionality + would change the behavior a bit (Heiko) + yes, functionality is different across apps (Stuart) + conclusion: let's be consistent with the other apps out there (Kendy) AI         + please move Impress & Calc entries to Insert to be              consistent (Jay) + overall, using this functionality from the menu is not ideal (all) + too confusing - why a submenu? (Heiko) + 'Character' or 'Font' (Jay) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86302 + apparently Word really leads to a dialog that only sets the font (Kendy) + but here we allow to set more - all the character properties + conclusion: Let's leave it as it is AI         + close bug 86302 as wontfix (Jay) + http://user-prompt.com/how-do-you-want-libreoffice-calcs-toolbar-configured/ + results - https://docs.google.com/document/d/1A0-40WnOk4099N3DPiQs36d5Od9Bxuc3cCpIhIb6Qe8/edit?pli=1 + shows that the biggest area of improvement needs to be of         style and having predefined ones + alignment, font size etc. used quite a lot + border color not used at all + many people do not know about styles in Calc + and people don't use that much + suggestion: more prominent setting for styles + some buttons can be removed: open gallery for example + freeform notes: + make the styles more visible + do the UX changes in smaller chunks between versions + standardization: some features in toolbar, some in sidebar + how hard would it be to use the same dropdown as in Writer? (Kendy) + better to use the Styles dialog in sidebar (Jay) + the key is to have the preview in the Sidebar too (Jay) + https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=109138 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86039 + we have too few styles in Calc currently (Jay) AI     + brainstorm about some nice / more styles for Calc (Ahmed, Jay) + would be useful to have more split buttons in the toolbar (Jay) + otherwise has hidden things that are not used + will publish the blog tomorrow after Jay proofreads (Heiko) + https://github.com/libodesign/flat-icons - old, locked, reference only + https://github.com/libodesign/icons + script to generate the icons automatically (Kendy) + has done some new icons (Ahmed) + will push shortly + some more coming soon + the storage a bit confusing (Jay) + be careful about conflicts (Jay) + please send me the info again (Ahmed) https://redmine.documentfoundation.org/boards/1/topics/35 + macOS will use the Sifr as the default + syncing about what icons need to be done with Matthias (Jay) + with all the (IMHO mostly great) changes in menu & toolbar, I     would suggest to prepare a nice blog exlaining all, or major changes, or ... whatever, just to hand out to our users looking around in vain searching for their favorites ;)     could ask on marketing@ ??    + including that info in the blogs after surveys (Jay)    + makes sense to talk about this (Heiko)    + would be really useful around the release time (Kendy)        + could even do a video "this leads to a dialog you've never          opened" funny one :-) (Jay) + What happened with large icons in sidebar matching large icons in     toolbar? + I remember we discussed it and Kendy said he'd do something about it       + maybe we should have a different drop down in Tools > Options to set the size of sidebar icons AI + not sure about the dependencies in the code, check (Kendy) + maybe have that as an additional setting? (Jay) + better not, too many settings already (Kendy) + uno commands have been found and listed - https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=84258#c2 this fixes the toolbars and menus + Easy-hackize this (Kendy) + additional work is needed for the context menus Impress: Context Menu > Slide > Page Setup Draw: Context Menu > Page > Slide Design + It is a question that i've been thinking of and a survey commenter also suggested the same http://user-prompt.com/how-do-you-want-libreoffice-calcs-toolbar-configured/#comments (last comment by GT) + office icon sets that can be purchased http://www.top4download.com/office-style-icon-set/bjrststh.html http://www.perfect-icons.com/stock-icons/perfect-office-icons.htm + I'm not in the Board - better ask them (Kendy) + but guess it is hard to get somebody employed or hired to do         icons only (Kendy) + the preferred way is to enable people to do things, not to buy a solution (Kendy) + then again - I believe a Design hackfest, or some design-related h/w (wacom pen tablet or so) for people already doing great things (enabling them to do more/better) might be possible (Kendy) + Decimal and Standard Number Format buttons in Calc https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86119 + Zoom Mode button in Impress/Draw - https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=83572 + syncing with Maxim already (Jay)
 * Present: Ahmed, Jay, Heiko, Kendy, Stuart
 * Completed Action Items:
 * Pending Action Items:
 * UI changes integrated the last week:
 * Last week's discussions that need a resolution:
 * Survey to revamp Calc toolbar (Jay, Heiko)
 * Sifr Icons (Ahmed)
 * Blog post about the changes in menu & toolbar (Cor)
 * Sidebar Issues (Jay)
 * Impress / Draw code share problem (Jay)
 * Would TDF consider hiring a company to do an icon set (Jay)
 * Buttons with toggle issues (Jay)
 * Context menu access to styles (Jay)

+ adding paragraph applied and custom paragraph styles to context menu https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85940 + seems that we have multiple things to improve around styles (Kendy) + GSoC task to improve usability & accessibility of styles (Kendy) + https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/GSoC/GenialIdeas AI     + add a Styles usability improvements section + list the various things to implement (Jay) + styles previews in the sidebar etc.


 * Easy access to line thickness options (Jay)

+ have simple preset drop down fields rather than manditory value fields (similar to sidebar) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=48622 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=59895 (page 5 and 6) + the thickness has a preview (Kendy) + adding an additional listbox would clutter the dialog even more (Kendy) + possibility to add it as a text that changes accordingly + not sure how to make this an actionable task...       + GSoC task maybe? - this cannot be made easier just by an Easy Hack :-(       + would be necessary to collect the requirements + various uses          of this AI          + talk to Milos (Kendy)