Design/Meetings/2014-11-12
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Link
http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Minutes-of-the-Design-Hangout-2014-11-12-tt4129528.html
Minutes
Nov 19, 2014; 1:24am Jan Holesovsky-4
Minutes of the Design Hangout: 2014-11-12
* Present: Ahmed, Cor, Heiko, Jay, Kendy, Steve, Stuart
* Completed Action Items:
+ Jay: Bug report that custom and used styles should appear in the
Styles dropdown.
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85930
+ Jay: Update Writer, Impress + Draw to include "Align" like in
"Align Left", "Align Right" etc.
+ Jay: Update svx/uiconfig/ui/paralinespacingcontrol.ui with better
icons (cmd/something...)
+ Jay: Hide the paragraph background toolbar button.
+ Jay: "List of Changes..." -> "Manage Changes..."
+ Samuel: Change sidebar so that that it returns to the previous
state when you eg. use F11 twice.
+ Kendy: Set updating reference to false for 4.4
+ Kendy: Push patch to default to large icons even on Windows.
[we do that on all the other operating systems already anyway]
* Pending Action Items:
+ Kendy: Create Easy Hack for images.zip layering (if it does not
exist yet)
+ And also Easy Hack for downloading additional themes?
+ Kendy: GSoC task (or so) for converting "Manage Changes..." to
sidebar (instead of non-modal dialog)
+ Kendy: Adjust alignment and spacing in line spacing drop down -
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=83076#c11
+ Samuel: Sidebar - hide the decks, but keep the sidebar (only the
icons) there.
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85935
[Kendy - please take this over. Can't figure that out (Samuel)]
+ Samuel: Add Close menu entry in the sidebar's menu that acts like
View -> Sidebar toggle
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85937
* Conference logo
+ Conference logo: https://redmine.documentfoundation.org/issues/710
+ Not many responses about it in ml:
http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/msg06785.html
k-j is working on it.
+ at the moment we don't have many artists for bigger graphics
+ should we advertise that on the social media etc.? (Kendy)
AI + redmine thread - will add, and also twitter + G+ (Jay)
* UI changes integrated the last week:
+ Select and toggle off master elements in Impress via Delete (Caolan)
+ Toolbar drop down menus are added to bullet and numbering buttons (Maxim)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85789
+ Writer statusbar will show zoom features at 800 pixels width (Samuel)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86018
+ Makes the toolbar a bit too wide? (Kendy)
AI + Will check (Jay)
+ Calc toolbar revamp using OOo stats (Jay)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85594
+ Impress toolbar revamp using OOo stats (Jay)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=84909
+ Unifying the click behaviour in statusbar (Samuel)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=82707
+ Add missing statusbar toolips (Samuel)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=82708
+ Default to large toolbar icons on Windows (Kendy)
* Last week's discussions that need a resolution:
+ "Gallery" was renamed to "Clip Art Gallery" in the sidebar (Jay)
felt the use of the word 'Gallery' wouldnt be wise as i've
proposed new sidebar tabs like 'Styles Gallery'
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86040
https://redmine.documentfoundation.org/boards/1/topics/430
+ changed that, is that suitable? (Jay)
+ primary reason: better understanding, because gallery may mean
many things (Jay)
+ but the problem is that there might be also sounds and other
stuff (Jay)
+ another possibility might be a "Styles Gallery" (Jay)
+ if we talking the tooltip, could be "Gallery - Clip Arts,
Sounds and more"? (Kendy)
AI + will try if the long tooltip can be there, if not, revert (Jay)
+ Adding View > Graphics (Jay, Adolfo)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86184
+ possibilities to turn on / off things like the non-printing
characters, etc. (Jay)
+ not sure about the use case (Kendy)
+ if something is slow, we should make it faster in the
first place :-) (Kendy)
+ the speed is not the only thing - might be useful
otherwise (Jay)
+ would prefer not to introduce this :-) (Kendy)
+ let's leave it for the moment as is & see more in the issue
+ Merge Document being outside of the Track Changes submenu (Jay, Cor)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85046
+ changed to main entry in the Edit (Jay)
+ I like this (Kendy)
+ no disagreement - let's try this for the feature freeze
+ oppose: it's contrary to the nature of the feature... pls
read comment #8 (Cor)
* Alex pasted this in the google chat while we were at last week's
meeting (Jay)
+ Hi Jan, I can't join this week since I have a lab report that's
due. What might be worth discussing is whether we want to go for
a flatter look regarding the text icons:
the second one in https://redmine.documentfoundation.org/attachments/download/358/bold%20icon.svg
All the flat text icons: https://github.com/libodesign/icons/blob/master/text.svg
+ icons too dark in the 4.3 (Jay)
+ did some polls on this on twitter etc. (Jay)
+ Alex suggested an icon with a plain color
+ best to have decide between Jay and Alex (Kendy)
+ both look fine to me (Kendy)
+ likes the 2nd one (the Jay's one) (Ahmed)
+ in general, best if you agree between the guys doing the
icons :-) (Kendy)
+ of course, if something becomes controversial, please
bring it to the meeting
* HIG's
+ LibreOffice uses the GNOME HIG's (Kendy)
+ but which ones? - there are 2 different ones ;-) (Heiko)
+ https://developer.gnome.org/hig-book/3.2/design-window.html.en (Kendy)
+ "This version of the Human Interface Guidelines was written
for designers and developers of GNOME 2 applications....")
+ HIG for Gtk3:
http://blogs.gnome.org/aday/2014/08/21/new-human-interface-guidelines-for-gnome-and-gtk/
not finished, AFAIK, (Heiko)
* Pushing text wrap into calc 4.3 (Jay)
+ https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/12254
+ pushed now
* Important shortcuts additions (Jay)
+ shortcut for AutoSpellcheck (ctrl+shift+F7 globally used by
Hangul/Hanja Conversion, shift+F7 used by trace presedents in
calc)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=82969#c5
+ important when we don't have that in toolbar any more (Jay)
+ what about Alt+F7? (Kendy)
+ will check (Jay)
+ but Alt is not good for a general shortcut (Heiko)
+ conclusion: Least problematic is to switch Shift+F7
+ shortcut for track changes (ctrl+shift+E newly taken up by Edit Mode)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86183
+ MS Office uses Ctrl+Shift+E
+ but the Ctrl+Shift+E is recent addition (Kendy)
+ so still can be changed; let's find something new for the
Edit Mode (Kendy)
AI + OK (Jay)
* Menu Improvements (Jay)
+ File menu - https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=109001
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85945
+ I like it (Kendy)
+ Impress View Menu - https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=109353
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86209
+ quite unorganized (Jay)
+ rearranged to be more similar to other modules (Jay)
+ I like it too (Kendy)
+ any objections to these re-works?
+ no objections
* Clipboard and background color survey result published (Jay, Heiko)
+ http://user-prompt.com/de/standard-toolbar-in-libreoffice/
+ clarification of stance that i had last week
+ Kendy misinterpreted the conclusion a bit at the ESC - not
necessary to get more data, more important to allow smoother
transition (Kendy)
+ google docs leaves only the paste and format painter, so this
might be a good first step to get people off the toolbar for
clipboard functions
+ I like this approach (Kendy)
+ conclusion: let's try to remove Cut + Copy for 4.5
+ Arguments: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=84848
* Sifr survey preliminary results (Heiko)
+ https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BYyV9O4frnRrcwyxIZly_7gGQp8zhdKGilHi7CQ3v64/edit?usp=sharing
+ results relating to which icon sets to keep
+ ~60% use tango (46% stick with default), 21% use sifr, 8% use
oxygen, 6% galaxy, 3% crystal
+ 41% windows, 52% linux, 6% mac
+ on mac: its a 50/50 split between sifr and tango, though
47% don't change the default tango
+ would be good to get what the breakdown of icon sets used by
different OSes (Jay)
Crystal Galaxy Hicontrast Human no answer Oxygen Predefined Sifr Tango
Linux (GTK+) 0 3 0 5 0 1 31 19 18
Linux (other) 0 1 0 2 0 2 11 5 3
Linux (Qt) 2 3 0 0 0 16 19 13 2
macOS 0 0 0 0 0 0 9 8 2
no answer 0 0 0 0 1 0 1 1 0
Windows 6 12 1 0 2 4 69 18 12
Crystal Galaxy Hicontrast no answer Human Oxygen Predefined Sifr Tango
Low Usage 4 2 0 3 0 7 48 13 9
High Usage 4 17 1 0 7 16 92 51 28
Crystal Galaxy Hicontrast Human no answer Oxygen Predefined Sifr Tango
Age <40 5 11 0 6 2 15 93 50 24
Age >40 3 8 1 1 1 8 47 14 13
* Survey to revamp Calc toolbar (Jay, Heiko)
+ http://user-prompt.com/how-do-you-want-libreoffice-calcs-toolbar-configured/
* Opening track changes toolbar (Jay)
+ toolbar should open when opening document with track changes
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=83958
+ toolbar should open whe user clicks Edit > Track Changes > Record
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85741
+ would be useful (Kendy)
+ would need the possibility to turn off the auto-popping up tooo (Cor)
+ as it is with the tables / bullets etc. toolbars
AI + who will do that? :-) - find out (Kendy)
* Automatic small or large icons for all platforms (Jay)
+ With automatic set for icon sizes in LO, below 1280 should be set
to small.
+ not on the other OS'es, and people did not complain (Kendy)
* Sifr Icons (Kendy)
+ got SVG sources from many people, Big Thank You! (Kendy)
+ now need to categorize that a bit
+ TODO count coverage / create page showing the progress
+ Papamatti and Jay are working on improving sifr icons, so
there are a number of new or modified icons that arent in the
SVG sources, but are available on github.
+ current state?
https://redmine.documentfoundation.org/boards/1/topics/35
(papamatti working on it).
+ problem pushing - cannot push any more (Ahmed)
+ https://github.com/libodesign/flat-icons - old, locked
+ https://github.com/libodesign/icons
+ new one
+ has 2 layers - one for Tango, the other for Sifr
+ helps to get the idea from Tango, and draw Sifr
AI: + will ask Mirek for access to the new repo (Ahmed)
* Making sifr default on Mac (Steve, Jay)
+ with macOS now having flat icons, it would be useful to have
sifr as default
+ how iWork Pages looks now - http://i.imgur.com/P5X7FSt.jpg
+ we should want to promote the icon set build by LibO, as macOS
is a good starting spot
+ sifr incomplete - is there a technical solution for the missing
icons?
+ like change the colors of the HiContrast to something gray? (Kendy)
+ does not look like it is possible to use it that way (Steve)
+ Writer by default already complete (Steve)
+ and the fastest evolving icon theme (Steve)
+ Sifr icons improvements
https://redmine.documentfoundation.org/boards/1/topics/35?r=439
+ conclusion: Let's do it for 4.4
+ if too problematic for people, can revert for the final
release (Kendy)
+ fixing / introducing new icons in the beta phase is not an
issue (Kendy)
+ could post a note to
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=42082
AI + Will do the switch (Kendy), Steve can test then, has a Mac
+ any plans for Sifr to work as hicontrast? (Heiko)
+ Sifr uses one color, the rest is handled by transparency (Jay)
+ easy to do this programmaticaly then :-) (Kendy)
+ just to change this color to any other on the fly - white
for Hicontrast eg. (Kendy)
* Similar base code for impress and draw causing problems (Jay)
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=84258
+ they are sharing the same code, which is causing problems with
labels and icons
+ the word 'slide' appearing in draw
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=84208
+ the word 'page' appearing in impress
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=84257
+ shouldn't be hard to add appropriate .uno: commands (Kendy)
+ sort one out, and Easy Hack-ize the others?
+ add what .uno: commands need such handling to the bug
AI + will collect them (Jay)
* Controversial changes in bugzilla (Cor)
+ when a consensus is reached, can still go to 4.4 if it is a bugfix (Kendy)
+ if it is a feature - then either can be approved as a late feature
(via ESC)
+ or has to wait for 4.5 (Kendy)
* Sidebar Issues (Jay)
+ Swapping increase and decrease buttons in Sidebar
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85776
+ cropped elements
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=79758
+ adding style drop down
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=73071
+ OK to change as you think should be best (Kendy)
+ its (supposed to be) not open by default, not expect changes
to be controversial