QA/Meetings/2013/November 18

    From The Document Foundation Wiki
    < QA‎ | Meetings‎ | 2013
    Meeting of the QA Team

    previous - next

    Date and Time (UTC) 2013-11-18 19:30 UTC
    G+ Hangout [ This Meeting]
    Chair Robinson Tryon
    Secretary Robinson Tryon
    Started 19:35
    Adjourned 21:00
    Participants Robinson, Joel, Florian R., Sophie, Tommy, Thomas, Joren, Stuart
    Pad http://pad.documentfoundation.org/p/qa
    Talkyoo Room Number 537138

    Prep

    • Joel suggested we do prep with call members ahead of time so that they know how to
      1. Connect (via Hangouts or Talkyoo)
      2. Mute and/or Find a quiet room
    • Should we start the call a few minutes early to help newcomers? (Robinson)
    • Yes -- Add a note to the times for the next QA Call
    • Added a note to the Talkyoo page about muting your microphone by default (Joel)
      • Similar note added to QA Etherpad (Robinson)

    Agenda + Minutes

    Minutes:

    Content from the meeting itself ("the minutes") will be displayed in blue boxes like this.


    Start

    • Meeting started at: 19:35
    • Participants: Robinson, Joel, Florian R., Sophie, Tommy, Thomas, Joren, Stuart

    Notes:

    The State of QA

    Including any Opening Discussion

    UNCONFIRMED Bugs

    UNCONFIRMED bug count:

    • November 4th: 1189
    • Today (18th): 1144
    • Difference: -45
    • Awesome! Keep up the good work!

    Topics for ESC?

    Does anyone have any topics/concerns that I should bring to the Engineering Steering Committee (ESC)? (Robinson)

    Need_Advice Bugs

    Need_Advice bugs

    I'm going to bring up the following bugs:

    • tdf#43692 - FORMATTING text:use-soft-page-breaks not honoured - Waiting for Miklos (or someone else)
    • tdf#45644 - Inconsistent behavior of table.Borderline in Writer and Calc
    • tdf#47474 - missing "ParentWindow" property on XUIElementFactory::createUIElement API - UNO/API ask Michael Stahl or S Bergmann - Got update from Michael Stahl on this one.
    • Bjoern was concerned we might see a spike in the number of unconfirmed bugs with the release of Ubuntu, but didn't happen (Joel)
    • Particularly annoying FTP bug (Joel)
      • tdf#62981 - FILEOPEN: Speadsheet display nothing in file xls on ftp sever
      • Had trouble duplicating this bug; marked as NEEDINFO (Robinson)

    Discussion

    "Ask, Bugzilla and Planet TDF's twitter accounts"

    (see Zeki's email for details)

    • Is anyone in QA interested in taking the reins of the Bugzilla twitter account?
    • Anyone want the LibreOffice Bugzilla twitter account? (Robinson)
      • This twitter account is an EasyHack (Florian R.)
        • Usefulness? (Joel)
      • Leave it as read-only feed? (Robinson)
        • ACTION: - Robinson will talk to Zeki, get creds for the QA Team and make it a read-only feed

    User perception of QA and Bugzilla

    • Example from this week: Tanstaafl's email - "The 'new' website is...difficult to navigate...My simple goal was to log into the Bug system, check 'My Bugs' and see [stuff]....What if I don't want to report a bug, but only want to search for bugs?...How do I just log into the bug reporting system and search it? Anyone?"
    • Charles is leading the website redesign in Marketing.
      • What input would QA like to have in this process?
    • Some easy way to see all of the teams and join one (Joel)
      • Tell our users it's not complicated
    • Think this is related to our Feedback page (Florian)
      • Agreed. Starting with the Feedback page and moving to our community pages, we need to convey an appropriate feeling (Robinson)
      • Point of contacts? Actual people? Not a leader, but someone who can answer questions (Joel)
        • Mentors? (Robinson)
        • Lists are a good place to go, but overhead of joining and overload of multiple responses can be daunting (Joel)
    • ACTION: Joel will email to QA List about message we'd like to convey to Marketing/Website for community involvement

    Pending Items

    PENDING ITEM: BugReport Page

    • [SUPERSEDED] ACTION: Connect with local team leaders (monthly meeting?) and work to interact with those teams in a different way (Robinson)
    • ACTION: Robinson will talk w/sophie later about best way to interact w/local teams
      • I'm gonna organize a meeting for RC1 with all the teams (Sophie)

    PENDING ITEM: QA Website

    • [DONE] ACTION: Florian R. will set up QA Website work as a QA EasyHack

    PENDING ITEM: Tollef and Bugzilla TODOs and planning

    • [DONE] ACTION: 1st draft of proposal -> send to QA List (Robinson)
      • Nov 9th - Created proposal and sent to QA list (Robinson)
      • Topics to discuss:
        • Outstanding work:
          • Dennis Roczek volunteering to help automate changes on the wiki.
          • Identify all remaining tools/websites/etc.. dependent on Bugzilla
        • Abbreviation: blo#12345

    Older:

    • ACTION: Get Tollef to activate voting on FDO (merged item)
    • ACTION: Get Tollef to add BOLD statement to each FDO mail sent out to not reply via mail (merged item)
    • ACTION: Get Tollef to clarify 'version' label in Bugzilla (merged item)
    • ACTION: Will track the filed bug and wait to hear updates (re: Bold statement on FDO mail)
    • ACTION: Continue discussion (long-term) of move to Locally-hosted Bugzilla
    • Robinson - Unsure when Tollef will be done
    • What if we can't migrate for a few months? (Joel)
      • Cloph set up bugs.documentfoundation.org -> bugs.freedesktop.org, so no sweat: We can use the redirect indefinitely (Robinson)
    • Fine with "B-L-O" but when pronounced as "BLOW" it's... not ideal (Stuart)
      • What about "LOB" ? (Tommy)
      • What about "TDF" ? (Stuart)
    • ACTION: Robinson will bring blo, lob, tdf, libo to ESC and ask them for input

    PENDING ITEM: Update the whiteboard/keywords page

    • [SUPERSEDED] ACTION: Joel will update the whiteboard/keywords page
    • ACTION: Joel will turn this into an EasyHack and work on it (slowly)

    PENDING ITEM: Bibisect Repositories

    • ACTION: Combine existing bibisect repos into one (starting pre-fork) (Robinson)
    • Made up a page about it QA/Bibisect/Bibisectzilla
    • Just need to sit down with Bjoern and hash details out
    • Size may be an issue for some contributors (Joel)
      • however, many problems with zsync (and large downloads), so perhaps much better for volunteers and for project bandwidth with git (Joel)
    • IDEA: Add bibisect into regular Developer workflow (Joel)
      • Would be two different repos, but might be something here we could do w/automated script (Robinson)
    • IDEA: Is there a way to figure out what LO versions correspond to this commit in master? (Joel)
      • Yes -- we could make a graph that showed if...
        1. A particular build incorporated this commit and 'all' previous commits.
        2. A particular build cherry-picked in this commit (but not all previous commits)

    PENDING ITEM: GUI for Bibisect

    • [DONE] ACTION: Joel will talk to Cor about (possibly working on) the bibisect GUI
    • ACTION: Punt on implementation until after we have bibisect repos up and running (All)
    • Cor is happy to review, but doesn't have time to write code (Joel)

    PENDING ITEM: Feedback pages

    • [DONE] ACTION: Robinson will go ahead with the Feedback page idea (and ping Rob)
      • Nov 5 - First draft of Feedback Page is now up - Suggestions/patches welcome :-)
    • Cloph suggests that we create a page in Silverstripe
      • Use localization tools built-in
    • Anyone interested in this project?
      • ACTION: Sophie will create page in silverstripe

    PENDING ITEM: Most Annoying Bug List

    • ACTION: Joel will propose stricter guidelines for what qualifies as a MAB
    • Whiteboard is becoming convoluted -> perhaps better formatting when we have our own bugtracker? (Joel)
    • MAB-Mockup: (Robinson)
      • Useful tool to do lots of powerful QA querying
      • Note that there's a way to indicate the earliest commit in which this bug shows up (usually located via bibisect)

    PENDING ITEM: Keeping track of bug statistics

    • [DONE] ACTION: Joel will come up with what statistics we want to track (just a couple for starters) and send to Rob
    • [DONE] ACTION: Rob will script up a first draft of stats report based on what Joel sends him
    • Rob knows what he wants to do here...wants to include charts (Joel)
      • There'd be a drop-down. Could show stats for any period over time
    • It would be great to try to merge this into the Bugzilla code and push upstream (Robinson)
    • If there's anything you're particularly interested in (stats-wise), ping Rob and ask him to add it (Joel)
      • Looking at the stats, looks like we need to focus some time there (almost 400 outstanding)
      • Thomas - Many (old) Writer bugs are hard to confirm/hard to know what they are talking about
        • If it's hard to understand repro steps, feel free to make a note and toss them into NEEDINFO state (Robinson)
    • ACTION: Joel and Joren will triage old Writer bugs; see if things need Need_Advice tag

    PENDING ITEM: Updates to the BSA

    • ACTION: Remove EOL versions from the BSA and implement 'please update' message (Rob)
    • General agreement to include (Joel)
      • Currently supported (stable) builds
      • Latest RC of each release branch

    PENDING ITEM: Tag Repro Needs in Whiteboard

    • [DONE] ACTION: Implement webpage displaying lists of NeedsXYZ bugs (Robinson)

    [Punting to Nov 18 because we didn't have many people on the call at this point on Nov 4th]

    PENDING ITEM: QA Contest T-shirts

    • [DONE] ACTION: Pick a printer and get the shirts printed (Robinson)
      • November 4 - Quote received from printer; printing now underway (Robinson)
    • T-shirts are done and sent!
    • Happy to see this done! (Joel/Robinson)
    • If you would like to purchase one, we have a few left (contact me for details)
    • If you're on the list to receive one, please send us an Action picture (e.g. you hard at work traiging bugs :-) wearing the shirt.
    • And thank you for your patience here... :-)

    Long-term/Frozen Pending Items

    These are long-term or frozen items (i.e. on ice until something else happens) that we don't want to forget about...

    PENDING ITEM: What to do with FDO bugs filed against Extensions, Templates

    • ACTION: Joel will continue to monitor the situation

    PENDING ITEM: Talk to CS Department/others at University

    • ACTION: Put up a message on the message board at his University and see who is interested (Joel)

    PENDING ITEM: Hackfests

    • ACTION: USA involvement in hackfests -- (Keep on the agenda, discuss on QA list) (All)

    New Action Items

    All items proposed between meetings go here

    NEW ITEM: Title (Author)


    New Items (Proposed/Discussed at the Meeting)

    NEW ITEM: Start Center and Sidebar (Stuart)

    There are some big issues with the Start Center and Sidebar in 4.2

    • tdf#61914 - META: Tweak the new template manager to act as a start center [a11y]
    • tdf#65138 - [META] Sidebar feature related issues

    Points:

    • Interest in having me (Robinson) bring up some points to ESC
    • We need to get keyboard navigation working properly under the new GTK UI widget designs.
    • tdf#70449 - StartCenter: it is not possible to easily navigate through recent used files with the keyboard
    • tdf#71628 - ACCESSIBILITY: new GTK+ UI start center keyboard navigation not acceptable [a11y]
      • ACTION: Stuart will break this out into multiple pieces
    • ACTION: Stuart will prepare talking points for Robinson before Thursday's ESC call

    Announcements

    End

    • Meeting adjourned at: 21:00

    Topics

    (Add topics below and reference them as #Example Topic in the Agenda/Minutes above)

    Example Topic