A few minutes before we officially start the call, we'll try to have a few people on hand to help assist newbies set up their teleconferencing gear, get things muted, and log on to all of our communication channels:
QA Chat today is in IRC (right here!) in about 10-15 minutes
- 02:35:19 PM -
- arnaud_versini has joined the room
- 02:35:34 PM -
Reisi007: colonelqubit: i do know Björn is not here. What about making it to Questions and answers. Need some update from me or are we finished?
colonelqubit: Reisi007: no word from joel...might be busy lawyering
Reisi007: colonelqubit: latest possible start time for me is now
colonelqubit: Okay, 3 is usually the cut-off for a meeting, so let's just chat for a little bit
* colonelqubit gives Reisi007 an attendance hat
Bugzilla Migration Update
colonelqubit: So: Norbert has done some great work with Bugzilla. Current phase is testing out our local install and making sure that the data migrates properly
* Reisi007 is giving colonelqubit "Chief in the office" hat
Reisi007: WOW - progress
colonelqubit: Oh, yes
- arnaud_v1 has joined the room
colonelqubit: Tollef has magically reappeared on the scene, and has gotten us a db dump
colonelqubit: (it's basically like Christmas for us...)
Reisi007: :-D black magic
* Reisi007 agrees
colonelqubit: We'll still want to do some further testing and want to script the migration process, including all of the setup of the VM for bugzilla
* colonelqubit realizes that shm_get is here -- Anything you'd like to add?
* shm_get is there not actively looking ... so need to chatch up what was said :-)
colonelqubit: Just a quick summary of where we are w/Bugzilla
Reisi007: colonelqubit: bibi gui has a dropdownlist for start and end range...
shm_get: oh... so yeah testing the reloaded bugzilla to detect anomalies if any... that is from the functional part.. from the admn/infra part.. I need to script thiings and practice teh re-install/migration from scratch.. as there is quite a bit of manual poking and oops, I'm not sure I know what I'm doing 'steps' involved still
- jmadero has joined the room
jmadero: colonelqubit: ping
jmadero: call open
jmadero: we doing this?
Reisi007: Good that we habe it soon
Reisi007: jmadero: irc tiday
jmadero: okay then let me go into library instead
jmadero: I'll be back - sun makes it hard to read screen
colonelqubit: need a Pixel Qi screen!
colonelqubit: shm_get: Thanks for the hard work! I'll look at the data, etc.. after this chat
arnaud_versini: jmadero: Hello
arnaud_versini: jmadero: Not on law stuff ?
colonelqubit: shm_get: have a goal about when you'd like to see the migration take place?
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- jmadero has joined the room
jmadero: okay sorry about that
jmadero: hi all
* colonelqubit waves
shm_get: colonelqubit not yet... I really want to nail the 're-install from scratch as this will also serve as disaster recovery process... and if we do not do it now, I'm afraid like most things it will be put on the back burner :-)
colonelqubit: shm_get: I agree
colonelqubit: jmadero: (just talking about strategy + timeline for bugzilla migration)
* Reisi007 too
jmadero: since I missed part of the conversation I'll refrain from commenting ;-)
colonelqubit: shm_get: when we feel like we're getting closer, we should look at our schedules and try to plan a good time when we'll have most of us on solid ground (i.e. not flying) for the switchover
shm_get: It depend on a lot of factor.. but I would count a couple of month probably... maybe sooner, but.. real-life can get in the way.. and there are unknown unknown (to quote an infamous Secretary of Defence :-) )
jmadero: do we have ETA? like ideal vs. realistic?
jmadero: we technically have the data already right?
jmadero: through the script
colonelqubit: jmadero: we have a dump from a ...week ago, shm_get?
jmadero: that seems worse than the updates Bjoern is getting
jmadero: his is up to date every hour
jmadero: running on big Bertha
colonelqubit: yeah, but it's a data dump
colonelqubit: sorry, db dump
shm_get: colonelqubit and yes.. once I feel confident that we nailed the technical aspect.. we will announce and advertise a migration planning.. so that everybody is aware of when/what/who.. and also because our user will _have_ to reset their password.. so we need to communicate way in advance
colonelqubit: shm_get: great!
----> OpenID for Bugzilla
jmadero: so I know shm_get isn't a fan of adding features right away
jmadero: but - having openID out of the gate I think would be nice
jmadero: like "you can reset your password OR use openID"
jmadero: no clue if that's feasible
colonelqubit: IIRC, it's not implemented?
shm_get: jmadero no, because there is no such things as openid support.. the suppsoed plugin are just vapourware
* Reisi007 has a look
jmadero: no bueno?
jmadero: what is vapourware?
jmadero: sounds like something you get high on
Reisi007: Is the same
shm_get: and the backup is a couple of week old.. but we will get a fresh one when we migrate.. in fact tollef will shutdown fdo bugzilla during the migration to make sure the backup is perfect
* colonelqubit . o O (...because Tollef has the Power...)
Reisi007: shm_get: sounds perfect
shm_get: jmadero vapourware is software that is hyped but is really nothing but wind (wind-pipe)
Reisi007: And close LibreOffice bug creation? / delete project?
jmadero: Reisi007: yes
jmadero: hopefully with a redirect
--------> OpenID: Collaborate on implementation?
colonelqubit: Suggestion: If we are looking at a roadmap of maybe 2 months, we could investigate what it would take to implement OpenID support (not necessarily impossible, if we convince other projects to fundraise w/us...)
shm_get: Reisi007 yep... once the migration is a sucess.. (we want to keep the door open for a rollback if we run into a major snag
jmadero: colonelqubit: so if this is really desired - I know Alex said having our own OpenID setup would be "low priority"
jmadero: so if it's dependent on that - I think no go for 2 month timeline
Reisi007: shm_get: okay :-)
colonelqubit: jmadero: most people are happy w/a launchpad OpenID
colonelqubit: (even the ones that don't want to get a Facebook or GMail account)
jmadero: isn't there some complaint about launchpad . . .?
jmadero: I forget what it is
colonelqubit: if you don't like Canonical, I guess
jmadero: but if that's manageable - I'm all for having it - I really think that would be a big + for users
shm_get: colonelqubit in any case: the migration will occurs using vanilla bugzilla version.. I do not want to compound problems and difficulties.. once we have our own instance, under our control, we can start thinking about deploying 'patch' and plugin in production.. but
colonelqubit: Anyhow, to stay on track here, I think investigating OpenID support for Bugzilla in parallel would be healthy, but shouldn't be a blocker on migration
jmadero: okay - well IMHO it seems like we're on different pages
jmadero: I like the idea
jmadero: shm_get: is against
shm_get: jmadero I am _not_ agaisnt openid at all
jmadero: against having it on deployment
jmadero: that's what I meant
jmadero: like you'd prefer baby steps ;-)
shm_get: jmadero it jsut does not exist today for bugzilla...
colonelqubit: I think migration is of significant importance to us, so I vote for no OpenID at migration date
jmadero: okay - that's fine
jmadero: so migration is moving forward
colonelqubit: UNLESS we pull off some super-feat and really believe it's rock-solid
shm_get: jmadero yes I do not want to deploy new feature _and_ migrate at the same time.. but even If I wanted there is NO openid support to deploy anyway
jmadero: I got it the first time ;-)
colonelqubit: (read: if shm_get says yes)
jmadero: but we can move on
colonelqubit: Update on the T-shirts saga: I sent a replacement shirt to Hackert
colonelqubit: crossed my fingers, did a little dance. With any luck, he'll get it
shm_get: note: IF there is a viable openid plugin, that has been tested and working.. we _can_ 1/ migrate 2/ quickly check that we are fine so that we can release tolleft and fdo and then immediately deploy that plugin... iow if the pluign fail to deploy we still have a working migrated system
Reisi007: Do we have libo merchandise up btw??
colonelqubit: Not yet, no
colonelqubit: I thought about it, and with all the travelling I do, I wouldn't be able to mange that stuff out of my place
jmadero: so no big box stored at your place?
colonelqubit: jmadero: That's not the problem, I just want to make sure that we ship promptly
colonelqubit: e.g. if I'm gone for a week for OSCON
colonelqubit: but we can talk about it
jmadero: sure - I'd like to have that done by the summer - we can do it together as I'll have a lot more time
colonelqubit: I want to bring up Impress Remotes -- Sophie has volunteered to write up some MozTrap tests for us
colonelqubit: kudos to her
jmadero: yeah - I just sent an email about that
jmadero: we'll see what Florian E says about it
colonelqubit: Our good friend Florian R. (who some of you may have heard of...:-) has volunteered to help with testing on both Android and iOS. We'll get him squared away w/bluetooth adapter for testing
jmadero: what in the world is a mini micro adapter
* colonelqubit . o O (....very small? ...)
jmadero: but just plugs into a normal USB port?
Reisi007: I can test wlan now
colonelqubit: jmadero: can be difficult to remove, sometimes
colonelqubit: Question: On FDO, the component is listed as "Android Impress Remote" -- should we generalize that to "Impress Remote"
Reisi007: But that is not what m meeks thinks users wants
Reisi007: colonelqubit: +1 impress remote
jmadero: I'll update now
arnaud_versini: jmadero: Micro is used on phone, mini on camera I think
colonelqubit: Reisi007: what did michael the bold say?
jmadero: that wlan isn't what's desired
jmadero: that it's mostly bluetooth
jmadero: I believe
Reisi007: Bluetooth is desired over wlan
colonelqubit: fair enough -- easier for me, don't have to poke holes in my firewall rules
Reisi007: Was some time ago
jmadero: what about Impress Remote (Android/OSX)
jmadero: for component
jmadero: or just Impress Remote
colonelqubit: just Impress Remote
colonelqubit: we have someone working on a FireFox OS version ...I think
jmadero: cron job tonight will update BSA
jmadero: cloph_away: just to confirm - we have a cron job setup for BSA right?
colonelqubit: that seems a little dangerous?
cloph_away: jmadero: will have soon :-) so far I keep doing it :-)
jmadero: kk - there's a new version and now component has changed
jmadero: oh crap will component change break BSA?
colonelqubit: no, I meant that if we have a cron job for it, we might not remember to test after we push a change
colonelqubit: Or maybe I misunderstand: Is the cron job for pulling git, or just for updating from FDO?
colonelqubit: cloph_away: ^^
colonelqubit: Anyhow, good that we have that updated now.
jmadero: updating from FDO I believe
colonelqubit: good, that's a much safer script to run via cron
UNCONFIRMED Bug Count
colonelqubit: UNCONFIRMED Bugs: 1054
colonelqubit: hmm....broke above 1000 again
colonelqubit: should we try to organize a time to chew through a couple hundred of them?
----> Organize Bug-Triaging session
jmadero: colonelqubit: my hope is to do this in May - I'll try to organize something but has to wait for that week
jmadero: worst case - just 3-4 of us can spend 4 hours
Reisi007: Sophie asked for it next week isn't it
jmadero: over a beer
jmadero: I can't do next week
- cloph_away is now known as cloph
jmadero: so if that's the case I'm out of the running
jmadero: I'll be basically offline from next Wed. - May 2
BugHunting session for 4.2.3
colonelqubit: Reisi007: Sophie was talking about the BugHunting session for 4.2.3
jmadero: which means bug count should go up further
colonelqubit: she said:
> So shall we push this on next week? I'll replace/remove this page
jmadero: I mean realistically for the experienced triagers - 3-5 per hour easy
Reisi007: Oh, okay... Bug Squash June :-P
jmadero: probably more
jmadero: especially if we look at enhancements - which IMHO we should just get through super fast
jmadero: looks valid - mark as NEW
jmadero: and make sure to include some note about enhancement so no promise
jmadero: etc... etc...
colonelqubit: jmadero is nicer than some triagers :-)
jmadero: lol or I'm meaner
jmadero: I don't want to get the email in 6 months
jmadero: "YOU MARKED AS NEW WHY HASN'T IT BEEN IMPLEMENTED!!!!"
jmadero: "my idea is WONDERFUL, DO IT NOW"
colonelqubit: Anyone been following the 'Outliner for LO' bug(s) ?
colonelqubit: in MS-Word, you can have an outline view in a pane on the left-hand side
colonelqubit: powerful tool for people who have a long documents with lots of content/chapters/etc...
jmadero: oh - that's cool
colonelqubit: has been a desired feature for a while
- MechtiIde has disconnected (Read error: Operation timed out)
jmadero: yeah I can't follow individual wishlist items ;-)
jmadero: toooo many
colonelqubit: Some bug commenters are helpful, providing info and etc..
colonelqubit: One guy said basically "Why hasn't this been implement? I'm going to start getting really vocal on all of the websites about it"
jmadero: awesome - I want to respond "have fun"
jmadero: buuuut in my current position
jmadero: I should refrain
jmadero: I have to bite my tongue a lot more these days
colonelqubit: Another commenter was trying to talk him down, pointing out that maybe the devs didn't see exactly what he was contributing to the project, etc..
colonelqubit: was a good diplomat
Bugzilla Time-saving Improvements
colonelqubit: So this brings up a good point: We often have to deal with tough users in Bugzilla
- Papamatti has joined the room
colonelqubit: I'm really hoping that when we have our own bugzilla we can implement some of the features we've talked about previously
colonelqubit: but also think about features to help us and the devs read bug comments
jmadero: colonelqubit: yeah it's on the wish list - to be able to mark useful comments, vs. pointless ones
jmadero: and somehow highlight
jmadero: + of course mark the one with the best description
colonelqubit: for example: we could put some flair on bugzilla users based on category: Devs, QA team, etc..
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jmadero: yeah - I think that conversation can wait until we have bugzilla up
colonelqubit: jmadero: sure, actively flagging/upvoting is good, but something automatic is nice because it doesn't take our time
jmadero: yeah for sure
jmadero: so highlight automatically people with special priv.
jmadero: the chosen ones
colonelqubit: And look: If one of us sees someone who is being really helpful, we can bump them up
jmadero: also - this would allow reports reported by devs to be automatically set to NEW
jmadero: also maybe build in BSA type "tree" within Bugzilla itself
jmadero: with an option to skip for those who have priv.
jmadero: so it automatically triages
jmadero: in terms of priority and severity
jmadero: lots of nifty things that can be done
jmadero: I love making to do lists for you colonelqubit
jmadero: it makes my shitty days 100x better
colonelqubit: Reisi007: update on bibisect-gui? I'm installing the package now
jmadero: I haven't tried to install again - I couldn't get it to work in Linux
Reisi007: Okay, just a tiny update - implemented jmadero feature request
jmadero: but an update was done so maybe fixed
Reisi007: Mono is needed, so it's best to install the monodevelop ide
Reisi007: And start the skript
Reisi007: Ubuntu has a bug with a font (jmadero's error)
jmadero: Reisi007: I removed the font and had same problem
Reisi007: Should be fixed with 14.04
jmadero: it wouldn't load
jmadero: but I'll try again when I have time
Reisi007: ?? Okay... TODO: Investigate over easter
Reisi007: The build is the very same on linux and win and it is working on Win, so it has to be your setup :-P
jmadero: didn't easter pass already....
colonelqubit: ACTION: Florian R. will make bibisect-gui work on Ubuntu....with Joel
jmadero: not over easter though
colonelqubit: jmadero: Next sunday, I think
jmadero: May - August my hours are going down to 1/3 what they are now so that's when I can get pounded with requests
colonelqubit: jmadero: don't worry, no due-date on that action item
colonelqubit: ACTION: Robinson will talk to other orgs that deploy Bugzilla about implementing (funding?) OpenID support
colonelqubit: Anyone else have QA-related topics?
jmadero: new RC is coming - please try to install
jmadero: play with it
colonelqubit: (I have one that's more general LO to bring up, before we end)
jmadero: that's it from my side
colonelqubit: Reisi007: anything?
Reisi007: One thing
Reisi007: i updated si- gui - online version update
colonelqubit: online version?
Reisi007: Everyone could put/update branches
Reisi007: Or latest Apache OO version
Reisi007: Online update (branch-xx daily)
colonelqubit: ah, ok
Reisi007: No software update needed (any more??)
Reisi007: Maybe one l10n and done ;-)
Reisi007: Volunteers to update the update document?
Reisi007: (Do not have the link ATM)
colonelqubit: do you need translation help, or?
colonelqubit: Reisi007: ^^
Reisi007: Nope, update the branch- urls twice a year
Reisi007: I will forget
colonelqubit: Hmm... can we make a note in the Release process somewhere to email you?
colonelqubit: (assuming that would be frequent enough)
Reisi007: When a new branch is tagged (eg 4.3)
Reisi007: That would be enough
Reisi007: (Or when you switch a win buildbot to a new branch)
colonelqubit: ah, ok
colonelqubit: Okay, couple things from me
LibreOffice US: New IRC channel #libreoffice-us
colonelqubit: First: new IRC channel #libreoffice -us for US-related chatter, outreach, marketing, etc...
colonelqubit: Hopefully Joel and I will be able to recruit some new talent from the US to join the QA Team :-)
LibreOffice Swag - for confs
colonelqubit: Second, I'm investigating LibreOffice swag (stickers, brochures, etc... stuff to hand-out)
colonelqubit: Reisi007: Were you at CeBIT?
Reisi007: Only my program colonelqubit
colonelqubit: It's like your child...wandering, unattended all over the world
colonelqubit: Reisi007: Any suggestions re: swag to hand-out at conferences? The basics are stickers, brochures...
colonelqubit: I might investigate pens, 'cause those are a handy item to hold on to
jmadero: yeah pens - cheap things are good
jmadero: I really like the idea of USB's
jmadero: but more expensive
colonelqubit: jmadero: what do you think about pens that say "When the power goes out, use this analog edition of LibreOffice"
jmadero: lol clever
colonelqubit: "Download the electronic version online -- it never runs out of ink!"
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jmadero: lol yeah that's awesome
colonelqubit: "Inside every LibreOffice pen lives a tiny Joren.
He will break your shit."
jmadero: "report said "broken shit" to www.bugs.documentfoundation.org"
colonelqubit: If we ever build a tool to do fuzz-testing on libreoffice, we should definitely name it 'joren'
colonelqubit: Whenever it crashes the binary, it can send out alerts like "Joren wins again!" "Joren is in your treehouse, breaking your collectable plates!"
colonelqubit: "Joren laughs at you"
colonelqubit: Okay, that's all I have
colonelqubit: jmadero, Reisi007: Anything else?
jmadero: none here
ODF Badges from FSF
colonelqubit: Ran across some nice ODF badges here: https://www.fsf.org/campaigns/opendocument/spread
colonelqubit: jmadero: here's my first draft of badges for the DocLiberation site: <not ready for primetime yet>
jmadero: where would you put those?
jmadero: nice these are awesome
colonelqubit: The Excel...lent one is so corny
jmadero: oh yes
jmadero: I thought the same
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colonelqubit: Okay, thanks for the meeting!
jmadero: thanks colonelqubit
jmadero: next meeting I won't be able to attend
jmadero: after that - for the length of the summer
jmadero: much more attentive :-D
Does anyone have any topics/concerns that I should bring to the Engineering Steering Committee (ESC)? (Robinson)