QA/Meetings/2014/June 04

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    (Remember: Meeting shifted to Wednesday at 17:30 UTC at the new day/time...)

    Meeting of the QA Team

    previous - next

    Date and Time (UTC) 2014-06-04 17:30 UTC
    G+ Hangout http://bit [dot] ly/LibO_QA_call_hangout
    Chair Robinson Tryon
    Secretary Robinson Tryon





    Joel, Robinson, Florian R., Joren, Bjoern, Jay

    Talkyoo Room Number 537138


    Agenda + Minutes


    Content from the meeting itself ("the minutes") will be displayed in blue boxes like this.

    Before we Start

    A few minutes before we officially start the call, we'll try to have a few people on hand to help assist newbies set up their teleconferencing gear, get things muted, and log on to all of our communication channels:


    Put start time and attendees list in the table

    IRC Minutes

    (Talkyoo meeting today)

    The State of QA

    Including any Opening Discussion

    • US
      • Hackfests update --> See PENDING ITEM
    • Impress Remote:
      • Bluetooth adapters?
    • xx- Bugzilla migration
      • Updates...
      • Re: need to reset passwords
        • Email notification ahead of migration
        • Tweak the change-password page and the front page to indicate that people will need to reset their passwords
        • Create an 'About our new Bugzilla' video as a part of our 'Intro to QA' series
    • Bugzilla:
      • SUGGESTION: Use to host Bugzilla
      • We can have both LibreOffice and some of the Document Liberation Project libraries all exist as top-level products in the bugtracker
    • QUESTION: Should we refocus ourselves as the TDF QA Team (to cover LibreOffice, DLP, etc.. ?)
    • Bluetooth adapters on their way (or about to start on their way)
    • Bugzilla -
      • We'll chat w/Norbert and Infra about overhead of running bugzilla
    • We already have multiple bugtrackers (Bugzilla, Redmine, etc..); avoid explosion of more trackers (Bjoern)

    Project Management:

    • What about global TODO lists? (across various TDF/LibreOffice teams) (Joel)
      • Perhaps something available via Redmine? Or a project management tool? (Robinson)
        • Best option for now is Wiki, but we'll still keep looking.
    • Still under consideration
    • Structured tool much better than wiki

    weekly status



    UNCONFIRMED bug count:

    • May 21st: 1150
    • Today: 1101
    • Difference: -49
    • ACTION: Joel will come up with strategies (bloggers? other marketing?) to get us under 500 UNCONFIRMED over the summer
    • [DONE] ACTION: Write a short blog post about joining the BugHunting 4.3 session (TODO: Joel, Florian R., all)

    Regression watch (Bjoern)

    * Regressions in 4.3 not in 4.2
    * Regressions in 4.2 not in 4.1

    • A lot of the bugs being bibisected are being fixed relatively fast (Joel)
    • What about emphasis on feature freeze period of release? (Joel)
      • The feature freeze exists; perhaps we could be more clear about this aspect of the release process

    Topics for ESC?

    Does anyone have any topics/concerns that I should bring to the Engineering Steering Committee (ESC)? (Robinson)

    • This # has grown to 81 this week
    • Would prefer to have no prioritization set when new bug is filed (Joel)
      • If we can keep up with the triage/prioritization load as new bugs are filed, then this makes sense (Robinson)
    • Having more granular information (e.g. which bibisected regressions are from the last few releases) would provide more helpful info for the devs (Bjoern)
    • Providing even more granular repro information will help us track down which commit/who introduced this regression (Joel)
      • What's the time cost for QA? Do we have enough manpower to tackle that step? (Robinson)
      • Has been relatively successful
      • Can also ask in the #libreoffice-dev channel if a particular commit is to blame (Bjoern)

    Need_Advice Bugs

    NeedAdvice bugs

    • Back up to 82
    • I'll chat w/devs again (Robinson)

    Pending Items

    Quick ACTION items:

    • ACTION: Order bluetooth adapters for Joren, Joel, Florian R. (Robinson -> Floeff)
      • Joel ordered one stateside (right?)
      • June 4 - Checking on ordering status w/Floeff (Robinson)
    • [DONE] ACTION: New QA call time will be 17:30 UTC on Wednesdays (every other week), starting on June 4th
      • Seemed to work last time -- let's keep it (Robinson)
    • Remaining bluetooth adapters will go out next week
    • Joel likes the new meeting time....we all seem to agree!
      • Doesn't conflict w/ common dinner time in Europe

    ITEMS from Joel

    • [DONE] ACTION: Clarify what 'PreBibisect' version means in Bugzilla (writeup on the wiki) (Joel)

    PENDING ITEM: Auto-updates for regular users and QA Testing

    • ACTION: Investigate auto-updates for regular users and/or for QA/testing purposes (Robinson)
    • ACTION: Open discussion again re:auto-update for QA on the mailing list (Robinson)
      • Related: tdf#78592 - "LibreOffice-Installation enhancement/medium NEW UI: Provide RSS feed for torrent downloads" (Joel)
    • Find time for this one!

    PENDING ITEM: MozTrap Localization

    • ACTION: MozTrap translation (GUI and tests) continues to be high-priority for QA (Needs someone to shepherd)

    To review:

    • Other project who might want to work on translating GUI w/us?

    PENDING ITEM: Bugzilla Migration etc.

    • ACTION: Organize time to stress-test new Bugzilla VM (Joel)
    • ACTION: Make sure to suppress outgoing email during our testing of the test Bugzilla (Robinson)
    • ACTION: Perhaps add Simple HTTP Auth (htaccess) control restricting access to (Robinson/Norbert)
    • ACTION: Resolve url for hosting our Bugzilla instance (Joel)
      • Deal with acronym if using url (tdf# ?)
    • ACTION: Set up call and/or thread(s) with the useful people on a mailing list (Robinson)
      • May 22 - Started process
      • June - Need to follow-up again with key people re: current progress (Robinson)
    • Chug, chug, chug...

    PENDING ITEM: Bibisect Repositories

    • ACTION: Chat w/Bjoern, etc... re: updates to bibisect repos (Robinson)
      • Propose docs on testing w/3.3.0 separately to place bugs in pre-LO category (Robinson)
    • ACTION: Make combined bibisect repo available for testing (Bjoern) + Provide better docs
    • ACTION: Provide documentation for mac bibisect on wiki (Bjoern)
      • Bjoern's done some work here... get update from him.

    To review:

    • IDEA: Add bibisect into regular Developer workflow
    • IDEA: Create graph/tool to show which builds contain a given commit
    • Proposal: Would like to have some improvements for Bibisect (Joel)
      • E.g. would like to auto-skip over known-bad builds of LO
      • Where should this type of bug/enhancement be filed? (against which product?)
    • We could possibly implement this by having two repos: (1) the bibisect repo, (2) bibisect tools/version blacklist (Robinson)
    • New feature for bibisect repo so you can just download a small tool that creates a mount point (Bjoern)
      • All the pieces that you never look at aren't downloaded -- just check out a single version from the bibisect repo
      • Proof of concept for now; more docs to come
    • ACTION: Create EasyHack to test all bugs tagged 'PreBibisect' to determine if they are also 'Inherited From OOo' (Joel)

    PENDING ITEM: GUI for Bibisect

    • ACTION:' Florian R. will make bibisect-gui work on Ubuntu....with Joel
    • ACTION Review BibiGUI -- any Windows/C# Python volunteer dev (Bjoern)
    • ACTION: Throw something at me [Robinson] if I forget [to poke at Python...] (Florian R.)


    • ACTION: SI-GUI: Contact the people running "interesting" Windows tinderboxes and ask for their assistance (Florian R.)
    • ACTION: Create an EasyHack bug for the process of translating the existing C# code into Python (or Java) (Florian R.)
    • How's the communication between QA (and the SI-GUI) and the Windows tinderbox owners? (Robinson)
      • Emailed out, but haven't heard anything back (Florian R.)
      • Would like to use the TDF tb's, but they're broken more frequently than other ones :(
      • Perhaps NAGIOS rules would help to make sure that tb's get fixed more quickly? (Robinson)
    • Re: BibiGUI: Windows is fast when accessing git directly, but verrry slow when accessing git via libraries (Florian R)
      • Perhaps we can focus on GUI development on GNU/Linux initially, and then improve Windows support later?
      • Also need to strip excess fat from the builds that are going into the bibisect repo (~ 1GB total per build right now!)

    PENDING ITEM: Feedback pages

    • ACTION: Sophie will shepherd native-lang versions of Feedback page

    To review:

    • Next steps for NL versions (bug #?)

    PENDING ITEM: EOL, Release series, and Stable versions

    • ACTION: We'll wait and see if the Fresh vs. Stable (esque) language ends up in the updater (Robinson)
      • May 5th - Punting to see until updater is fixed
    • ACTION: Joel will start a thread on the QA list where we can bring up concerns
    • There's not much we can do about this -- waiting for Marketing to make a decision, and devs to fix the updater
    • ACTION: Make enhancement request for this issue (so we can take it off the agenda) (Joel)

    PENDING ITEM: Planning Regular QA Events

    • ACTION: Create a wiki page that mirrors our Release Plan page to try to coordinate QA events in conjunction with our release cycle (Joel)

    PENDING ITEM: Daily builds for all platforms

    • ACTION: Robinson will take point on making sure we get daily builds for win/mac/linux
    • ACTION: Make NAGIOS rules a priority --> very important for Windows tb for SI-GUI/Florian (Robinson)

    PENDING ITEM: Hackfests

    • ACTION: USA involvement in hackfests -- (Keep on the agenda, discuss on QA list) (All)
    • ACTION: Joel & Robinson will chat about Boston

    Update on:

    • Potential Hackfest in Boston in July
      • State of QA Documentation?
    • Other Events: (School in Pennsylvania)?

    Long-term/Frozen Pending Items

    These are long-term or frozen items (i.e. on ice until something else happens) that we don't want to forget about...

    PENDING ITEM: US Merch Store

    • (Future progress)

    PENDING ITEM: Update the whiteboard/keywords page

    • ACTION: Joel will work on tdf#71761 - Cleanup Whiteboard Wiki Page slowly.

    Currently in progress. A sample can be seen here: Test

    • Joel's working on it
    • Complete list of whiteboard status --> whittling down from there
    • 60-70% done
    • Also keyword and version page

    PENDING ITEM: Most Annoying Bug List

    • ACTION: Joel will propose stricter guidelines for what qualifies as a MAB

    To review:

    • How is the test going? (using the 'Priority' field in Bugzilla)


    • Will work on this this week (Joel)

    PENDING ITEM: Talk to CS Department/others at University

    • ACTION: Put up a message on the message board at his University and see who is interested (Joel)
    • Need to meet w/Charlie R. to talk with his Uni contacts as well

    New Action Items

    All items proposed between meetings go here

    New Items (Proposed/Discussed at the Meeting)

    NEW ITEM: Bug Triage Suggested Priority (Joel)

    See notes: QA/BugTriage#Suggested Triage Order

    • Going to work on another one which is by component
    • There are two tables on the Bug Triage page (Jay)
      • Just a work-in-progress..fixing (Joel)


    • ANNOUNCEMENT: Our next meeting will take place... June 18th (Wednesday) at 17:30 UTC, unless otherwise noted on the QA/Mailing List.


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